CTR FlashPro tuning - dyno procedure

FK2 Civic Type R 2015-2017, FK8 Civic Type R 2017-2021, FL5 Civic Type R 2023+ and Integra Type S 2024+
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Hondata
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CTR FlashPro tuning - dyno procedure

Post by Hondata »

It is critical when on the dyno to have a lot of airflow over the intercooler. What we have seen with a number of dyno sessions is that without adequate air flow the intake air temperature will reach the point where more requested torque will result in a minimal power increase.

Look at the IATs and boost pressure over a run and the shape of the torque curve from the dyno. Symptoms are:
- torque peaks high and then tapers at high rpm
- IAT is more than 40F over ambient temperature
- boost is high (over 26 psi)

What is happening is that since the ECU is torque based as temperatures rise the ECU will target more boost. Since the turbo is at a point where efficiency is falling, more boost will give higher compressor discharge temperatures, and higher IATs. Higher boost will also give less ignition timing. Higher boost and higher temperatures will increase the change of getting knock, which will retard the ignition and decrease power for several seconds. None of this is good for power.

The good news is that you will not observe this behavior while driving as the air flow over the intercooler is much higher than with a fan on the dyno.

When tuning consider:
- more air flow
- limit peak torque using the maximum air flow table
- limit boost using the turbo maximum pressure ratio table (IAT)
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Re: CTR FlashPro tuning - dyno procedure

Post by Hondata »

Here's some more analysis.
fk8-dyno-2.png
fk8-dyno-2.png (25.15 KiB) Viewed 13376 times
Here is a dyno run on our dyno, 91 octane fuel, 80 degrees ambient. Note the end IAT of 127F, ignition around 8 degrees on the top end and some knock retard.
fk8-dyno-1.png
fk8-dyno-1.png (22.47 KiB) Viewed 13376 times
Another run from the same vehicle. Ignition was reduced to reduce knock. The ECU increased boost to compensate for the lower efficiency from the reduced timing. IAT peaks at 130F at the end of the run. No knock retard. Top end ignition around 6-7 degrees. This made more power than the previous run. (For the record this vehicle knocked on the first run because it had a restrictive exhaust).

Now here is a dyno run from a customer.
fk8-dyno-ht-3.png
fk8-dyno-ht-3.png (20.38 KiB) Viewed 13376 times
Ambient is 82F. Note the end IAT is 20 degrees higher and there is a lot of knock retard and the top end ignition is low. For this vehicle I would first increase the intercooler air flow and possibly reduce timing and air charge to get rid of the knock. But this might be tuning for the dyno and not the street conditions for the vehicle, so increasing air flow on the dyno would be a good first step.

These engines are very sensitive to ignition timing. The difference between 4 degrees and 8 degrees timing on the top end is around 20-25 hp.

Finally, you can't see if on the graphs but this ECU takes some time to run in closed loop after a reflash. It is in the tuning notes:
https://www.hondata.com/help/flashpro/fk2_fk2_notes.htm
You need to drive for 2 km and 2.5 minutes to get the ECU to run closed loop. You can do this on the dyno rollers / hubs.
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Re: CTR FlashPro tuning - dyno procedure

Post by FK8_Hoonigan »

Hondata wrote: Fri Apr 06, 2018 4:29 pm Finally, you can't see if on the graphs but this ECU takes some time to run in closed loop after a reflash. It is in the tuning notes:
https://www.hondata.com/help/flashpro/fk2_fk2_notes.htm
You need to drive for 2 km and 2.5 minutes to get the ECU to run closed loop. You can do this on the dyno rollers / hubs.
I wanted to post an observation i had last week while on the Dyno. For context, this is on a 2021 year model FK8.
I did my couple runs, all fine, flashed the secondary calibration while strapped on the dyno for comparison. After reflash, the typical Xmas lights on the dash would not go away regardless of how long we drove the car on the Dyno. After 15 mins we gave up on that, assuming that it was due to the car knowing the rear wheels were not moving. I dont know if this is something on the new models, but thought it was curious. Finally, the lights did go off after 15 mins of normal driving home. It was the longest it has ever taken, usually these lights go off by the time i leave my driveway.

Anyhow, just noting that some may encounter issues making the lights go away while strapped.
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Re: CTR FlashPro tuning - dyno procedure

Post by Hondata »

If you do not disable the VSA before starting a dyno run then you can get errors from the wheel speeds which will not clear on their own. For the next software version we added a more advanced OBDII diagnostics which allows you to clear (most) of the errors from modules other than the ECU.

The other thing is that you need to power off the ignition after a reflash within a minute or so.
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