I posted this on another board, but am looking to cover all possibilities for response. The issue is below:
Appearently the AEM wideband does not work with Hondata. I am certain I have it hooked up properly, and at idle/no load conditions RomEditor & HondaLogger both read 3.83v. If I give a rev or start driving even under load, the voltage starts moving around and acting normal by giving me decent a/f's etc.. But just sitting there idling while upping the fuel to the point of about killing the engine, RomEditor shows 3.83v. Testing the connection at the ECU on the o2 signal with my multimeter shows ~4.5v at idle. The voltages are obviously not in synch! How could this be? Now, there are no taps or anything on the D14 ecu input (obd1 wht/red), the wideband output is connected directly to that wire. I used ground from the wideband controller on the Chasis, Direct battery (how the aem instruction tells to ground), and even A6 (the stock heater controller ground). All of these resulted in the same voltage going in of 4.6v on my multimeter, but still only 3.83v in Hondata software. This doesn't make sense. I tried disconnected the signal ground (D22) and the voltage just goes wacky so obviously the signal ground is needed. I am pulling power from the Wideband controller from A25 which is what controls the narrow stock o2. How could a provided 4.6v from the wideband output tested with a mutlimeter come up different in the ECU.......Anyone????? Willing to try whatever it takes. One other thing, before I ever started the car, I clicked the car to accessory..and after about 2 minutes the o2 sensor was nice and hot on a cold engine....I'm positive the heater is working. Thanks.
AEM Wideband problem.
[read second paragraph to see what I found out]
I think I'm onto something. I have attached my datalog from a little drive around the block. http://www.boosted.org/aem_wide.rec. This is a recording with the Diode in place, which didn't seem to do a thing other then change my input voltage from 3.83 to 3.81. It's probably easier to follow the voltage when reading this recording in RomEditor. Now, you should notice that throughout the ENTIRE run, voltage in NEVER gets above 3.81. (for AEM stoich is OVER 4.0 volts). So while im idling it appears that the aem feeding 4.3 or 4.5 or whatever is out of range! You will also notice that most of the light throttle light load driving shows 3.81v....this should be an a/f of over 14, so again this all would be out of range of that 3.81v. A very interesting thing to note: Fastforward to 3:10, from this point I am simply sitting there idling...and start decreaseing the fuel table.....you can see the RPM's dropping..and at around 3:25 the car about dies from being so lean. Next I start going rich at about 3:35. Now you will clearly see that it will start adjusting the voltage once the A/F corresponds with a voltage UNDER 3.81. So basically, I believe that the Hondata is simply NOT working with any voltage over 3.81...it's acting like its out of range. Once i lower the voltage past 3.81, it seems to read fine. Anything above 3.81 it simply shows just that. I bet the other o2's that are working have a stoich and interesting voltages under 3.83/3.81? Is there a cap/bug in the software for voltages over that?!
Ok, I just did a perfect test, I'm now certain that it's NOT the AEM. Here's what I did......idle the car...shows 3.81v. Keep upping the fuel untill it comes down to 2.8volts. Now it's showing me a very rich A/F and guess what the output of the controller is??? 2.8volts!! So the voltages are in-synch to anything UNDER 3.81 volts...anything OVER 3.81volts on the controller (perfecly usable on the AEM) is clipped off and di
splayed as 3.81!! What gives? How can we fix this?? Thanks.
I think I'm onto something. I have attached my datalog from a little drive around the block. http://www.boosted.org/aem_wide.rec. This is a recording with the Diode in place, which didn't seem to do a thing other then change my input voltage from 3.83 to 3.81. It's probably easier to follow the voltage when reading this recording in RomEditor. Now, you should notice that throughout the ENTIRE run, voltage in NEVER gets above 3.81. (for AEM stoich is OVER 4.0 volts). So while im idling it appears that the aem feeding 4.3 or 4.5 or whatever is out of range! You will also notice that most of the light throttle light load driving shows 3.81v....this should be an a/f of over 14, so again this all would be out of range of that 3.81v. A very interesting thing to note: Fastforward to 3:10, from this point I am simply sitting there idling...and start decreaseing the fuel table.....you can see the RPM's dropping..and at around 3:25 the car about dies from being so lean. Next I start going rich at about 3:35. Now you will clearly see that it will start adjusting the voltage once the A/F corresponds with a voltage UNDER 3.81. So basically, I believe that the Hondata is simply NOT working with any voltage over 3.81...it's acting like its out of range. Once i lower the voltage past 3.81, it seems to read fine. Anything above 3.81 it simply shows just that. I bet the other o2's that are working have a stoich and interesting voltages under 3.83/3.81? Is there a cap/bug in the software for voltages over that?!
Ok, I just did a perfect test, I'm now certain that it's NOT the AEM. Here's what I did......idle the car...shows 3.81v. Keep upping the fuel untill it comes down to 2.8volts. Now it's showing me a very rich A/F and guess what the output of the controller is??? 2.8volts!! So the voltages are in-synch to anything UNDER 3.81 volts...anything OVER 3.81volts on the controller (perfecly usable on the AEM) is clipped off and di
splayed as 3.81!! What gives? How can we fix this?? Thanks.
AEM wideband
A problem with the AEM UEGO is that it's analog output is beyond the range that the Honda ECU input can read, so it can't read above about 14.3:1 A/F (3.8V or so). The only way around this I can see is to make a voltage divider and change the cali8bration, but so far no one has tried this.
Hondata
For those of you who just cant wait to build the circuit?
This is a rough draft of the tutorial on how to build the AEM to HONDATA signal conditioning box.
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/methods/
Also Available:
-O2 simulators
-Map Simulators
-Solid state nitrous switches
DSP applications
Imbedded control systems with data logging
YOU NAME IT, I CAN DESIGN IT?. FOR CHEAP
This is a rough draft of the tutorial on how to build the AEM to HONDATA signal conditioning box.
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/methods/
Also Available:
-O2 simulators
-Map Simulators
-Solid state nitrous switches
DSP applications
Imbedded control systems with data logging
YOU NAME IT, I CAN DESIGN IT?. FOR CHEAP
PLX M-200 experiencing same problem as AEM
Methods
I have removed my stock O2 and replaced it with the PLX m-200, and hooked up the wideband output. The HondaLogger software sees a constant 3.809v. This keeps the Lambda at a constant 14.49 in the dash display of the software after editing the lambda conversion tables.
I'm interested in the device you have engineered. Will it fix my situation?
Please e-mail me lkc@stlsoho.com or give me instructions on how to get this device from you.
My current Setup:
2000 Honda Prelude
JRSC @6PSI
RC 550cc injectors
Hondata s200
I have removed my stock O2 and replaced it with the PLX m-200, and hooked up the wideband output. The HondaLogger software sees a constant 3.809v. This keeps the Lambda at a constant 14.49 in the dash display of the software after editing the lambda conversion tables.
I'm interested in the device you have engineered. Will it fix my situation?
Please e-mail me lkc@stlsoho.com or give me instructions on how to get this device from you.
My current Setup:
2000 Honda Prelude
JRSC @6PSI
RC 550cc injectors
Hondata s200
Bitten by the boost bug
At the aforementioned 3.8V the device you are referring to would be reading an A/F above 17.5 :1. Unless you are tuning to that A/F (which you better not be!) you should not have a problem.
The device I created is intended for use with the AEM unit which produces an A/F ratio of around stoich at 3.8V.
The 3.8V that you are reading is either:
An open circuit reading ( you didn?t hook it up right )
Or
Any voltage above 3.8V? I.E. if you accidentally applied 12V to the input. The 3.8V is simply the highest voltage that the Honda ECU can recognize? Any voltage greater than 3.8V gets truncated down to 3.8V. Think of the Honda ECU input as having a 3.8V zener diode at its input? Any voltage above 3.8V gets dumped off to ground.
The device I created is intended for use with the AEM unit which produces an A/F ratio of around stoich at 3.8V.
The 3.8V that you are reading is either:
An open circuit reading ( you didn?t hook it up right )
Or
Any voltage above 3.8V? I.E. if you accidentally applied 12V to the input. The 3.8V is simply the highest voltage that the Honda ECU can recognize? Any voltage greater than 3.8V gets truncated down to 3.8V. Think of the Honda ECU input as having a 3.8V zener diode at its input? Any voltage above 3.8V gets dumped off to ground.
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jdmturbosol
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 12:58 pm
This is an old post.
I don?t frequent this forum, the only reason I knew it was here is because I ?subscribed? to it months ago.
The NEW AEM WBO2 (gauge type) does not need this fix. It has a 0-3.5V output.
The old AEM WBO2 (box type) does need it and I don?t sell them. I assume you went to my website and read my tutorial and explanation.
I do not sell the boxes. There are too many conflicts of interest here. I have not been received well by Hondata or AEM. The last thing I need is to get into some sort B.S. confrontation.
I do believe that my ranting had an influence on the change to 3.5V at AEM but other than that? Neither Hondata nor AEM were interested in what I had to say.
I am sorry my friend, you are on your own. I wish I could help you. I have clearly spelled out exactly what needs to be done. Any half-ass technician or engineer could EASILY build that box for you for a minimal cost. I suggest going to a near by college and trying to find a ?starving student? to make the box for you.
Good luck, I wish you well.
I don?t frequent this forum, the only reason I knew it was here is because I ?subscribed? to it months ago.
The NEW AEM WBO2 (gauge type) does not need this fix. It has a 0-3.5V output.
The old AEM WBO2 (box type) does need it and I don?t sell them. I assume you went to my website and read my tutorial and explanation.
I do not sell the boxes. There are too many conflicts of interest here. I have not been received well by Hondata or AEM. The last thing I need is to get into some sort B.S. confrontation.
I do believe that my ranting had an influence on the change to 3.5V at AEM but other than that? Neither Hondata nor AEM were interested in what I had to say.
I am sorry my friend, you are on your own. I wish I could help you. I have clearly spelled out exactly what needs to be done. Any half-ass technician or engineer could EASILY build that box for you for a minimal cost. I suggest going to a near by college and trying to find a ?starving student? to make the box for you.
Good luck, I wish you well.
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TeknoJunki
- Posts: 10
- Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2003 1:33 pm
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TeknoJunki
- Posts: 10
- Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2003 1:33 pm
DUDE,
Do you do any research AT ALL? :shock:
Have you not read any of these posts or visited the suggested websites? :?
If you need to ask a question like that you are NOT ready to buy a WBO2. :roll:
Listen, I feel bad for you so I am going to give you a hint:
AS I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES BEFORE Hondata can accept any O2 voltage between 0V ? 3.8V.
The WBO2 that you choose should have a ?useable? output that falls in this range. This means that the A/F ratio that your WBO2 represents at 3.8V should be no lower than say?.. 16:1 A/F or the HIGHEST A/F that you care to monitor.
That said, in ROM EDITOR (you can download a demo version if you are not at ?tuner?) there is a place where you enter your conversion table. It looks like kind of like this:
VOLTAGE A/F
0.5__________9:1
1___________10:1
1.5__________11:1
2___________12:1
2.5__________13:1
3___________14:1
3.5__________15:1
4___________16:1
YOU enter the values so that the WBO2 that YOU buy will work. Just about ANY WBO2 on the market will work.
There is one exception to that rule and that is the OLD AEM WBO2? But then if you had gone to my Website (or read the thread) you would know that.
Sorry to get down on you, but this is not a game. If you want to run standalone you need to know what the F you are doing. The only way to know what the F you are doing is to do RESEARCH.
Don?t ask simple questions and expect other people to spoon feed you. Read ALL of the ROM EDITOR instructions, ALL of the Honda Logger instructions, ALL of the posts on this board, Do research on the internet,
AND THEN
Come back and ask for us to help you understand anything that is left.
Good Day.
Do you do any research AT ALL? :shock:
Have you not read any of these posts or visited the suggested websites? :?
If you need to ask a question like that you are NOT ready to buy a WBO2. :roll:
Listen, I feel bad for you so I am going to give you a hint:
AS I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES BEFORE Hondata can accept any O2 voltage between 0V ? 3.8V.
The WBO2 that you choose should have a ?useable? output that falls in this range. This means that the A/F ratio that your WBO2 represents at 3.8V should be no lower than say?.. 16:1 A/F or the HIGHEST A/F that you care to monitor.
That said, in ROM EDITOR (you can download a demo version if you are not at ?tuner?) there is a place where you enter your conversion table. It looks like kind of like this:
VOLTAGE A/F
0.5__________9:1
1___________10:1
1.5__________11:1
2___________12:1
2.5__________13:1
3___________14:1
3.5__________15:1
4___________16:1
YOU enter the values so that the WBO2 that YOU buy will work. Just about ANY WBO2 on the market will work.
There is one exception to that rule and that is the OLD AEM WBO2? But then if you had gone to my Website (or read the thread) you would know that.
Sorry to get down on you, but this is not a game. If you want to run standalone you need to know what the F you are doing. The only way to know what the F you are doing is to do RESEARCH.
Don?t ask simple questions and expect other people to spoon feed you. Read ALL of the ROM EDITOR instructions, ALL of the Honda Logger instructions, ALL of the posts on this board, Do research on the internet,
AND THEN
Come back and ask for us to help you understand anything that is left.
Good Day.
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turbocivic4
- Posts: 46
- Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2003 1:39 am