KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

K-Series Programmable ECU installation questions / support issues
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killer9013
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KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:53 pm

- 2001 S2000
- serial number of your K-Pro: 50509
- version of software being used: 4.4.1.0
- ECU part number:37820-PRB-A04 Serial number: 2068-301607
- anything about the car which has been modified from stock which may affect the ECU: Berks HFC and Exhaust, Modified Stock Airbox
- when and where you got the K-Pro: Ballade Sports this month

Hello, I just installed a KPro ecu into my S2000 and I'm attempting to get a base tune on it to go see the tuner in the near future. I'm having an issue while attempting to run the ecu in closed loop mode. I'm running an AEM wideband 30-0310 as my O2. This is in the primary O2 location in the exhaust. When I enable closed loop (set the S.Trim levels above 0) the ECU is pulling fuel causing an very lean condition. I've added a bunch of fuel to the fuel table to get it to idle at 14.7 in open loop. The AEM is wired into "Analog 0" and the analog ground per KPro help files. It is configured using the 30-0310 settings in kmanager.

Does anyone have any idea what is causing the KPro to pull fuel when the vehicle is already running at 14.7? I don't understand why the S.Trim just keeps climbing.

I've included the calibration, a datalog of it running in open loop, and a datalog of it running in closed loop. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you.
Lean in Closed Loop.kal
(165.58 KiB) Downloaded 17 times
Idling in open loop.kdl
(1.03 MiB) Downloaded 14 times
Running lean when goes to closed loop.kdl
(955.78 KiB) Downloaded 15 times

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Spunkster
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Spunkster » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:46 pm

In the advanced closed loop tab have you tried enabling the target lambda tables?

killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:35 pm

Here is a log of it idling with the lambda tables enabled. The S.Trim is pushing it in the opposite direction now, causing it to go richer than the target and keep dropping. It's like the closed loop trims are working in reverse. Any thoughts?
running with lambda tables enabled.kdl
(1.78 MiB) Downloaded 15 times

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Hondata
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Hondata » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:00 am

Connect the wideband analog output to Analog 1 as well as Analog 0. In the calibration set Analog 1 to raw voltage. Then datalog and we'll be able to see what the actual wideband voltage is.
Hondata

killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:34 pm

From what I can tell, the raw voltage is following the AFR conversion chart very closely. I also don't see any wild jumps. Hopefully you guys can see something I'm missing.

The following datalogs are using the lambda tables, so it goes way rich in closed loop.
idling open loop with raw voltage.kdl
(1.52 MiB) Downloaded 13 times
idling closed loop with raw voltage.kdl
(1.44 MiB) Downloaded 14 times

killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:44 am

In the interest of trying to get to the root cause, I've typed up a pinout for the adapter harness supplied by Ballade. I was hoping one of you would be able to take a look at it to see if there is anything that appears to be miswired. I reached out to them for verification of the wiring, but they are being unresponsive.
Adapter Harness Pinout1.PNG
Page 1 of the harness
Adapter Harness Pinout1.PNG (42.54 KiB) Viewed 901 times
Adapter Harness Pinout2.PNG
Page 2 of the harness
Adapter Harness Pinout2.PNG (44.3 KiB) Viewed 901 times
The Vehicle Side A1, B9, C12, etc. refers to the connectors of the S2000 main ECU harness as found in ECU Pinout diagrams. The same thing applies on the ECU side but for the PRB ECU connector pinouts.

Please let me know if this is helpful, I know you may not have all the data on the Doctronic box etc but outside of that I'm hoping you can identify if something is wired strangely. Let me know if there is any other information that may be of use.

Thank you so much for the help you have been providing.

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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Hondata » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:27 am

Wait, why do you need a wiring harness? What is the doctronic box?

Do you have the KPro/S2000 sold by Hondata?
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killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:35 am

This is Ballade's "Plug and Play Kpro". Their harness allows you to use the stock AP1 sensors, valve cover, etc.. The "Doctronic box" is from Doctronics AP1 ECU solution and is part of their harness. It appears that it converts the Crank position signal and TDC signal of the stock sensors. The KPro is a unmodified Hondata PRB KPro, like you would be using on a stock 02-04 RSX. I'm working under the assumption that that part of the system is operating properly since I have no way to know for sure until everything else it ruled out.

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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Hondata » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:38 am

We're not going to diagnose someone else's wiring harness. Especially when doctronics has copied large parts of our IP and cloned some of our products.

However I don't think the closed loop operation is related and we will look into it.
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killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:41 am

I simply brought it up in an attempt to provide you with as much information as possible. I'm not asking you to troubleshoot their wiring, my intention of making the pinout was to highlight if any signal was obviously miswired and could be affecting the closed loop. This would hopefully then be visible in the datalogs.

I appreciate all of your assistance thus far.

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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Hondata » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:43 am

Found the problem. We'll do a release shortly for you.
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killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:00 pm

Awesome!! Hopefully it should solve the issues. So should I expect this as a firmware update to the KPro? Or will it be a software update to Kmanager?

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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Hondata » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:59 pm

link removed
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killer9013
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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by killer9013 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 4:40 pm

Closed loop works flawlessly now. Thank you so much for your help. I owe you many beers if you are ever up this way!

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Re: KPro4 going lean in closed loop (S2000)

Post by Hondata » Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:24 pm

No, it was our problem. Glad it is resolved.
Hondata

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